# How will new regulations affect you?



## RoBoTeq (Jun 18, 2009)

<P>With the new regulations dictating the minimum energy levels for cooling systems, heat pumps and furnaces depending on what region you are in, how is this going to change your business strategies?</P>


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## Doc Holliday (Jul 10, 2011)

No much if at all. 80% 14 seer minimum down here. We already do that.


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## user2561 (Dec 29, 2011)

RoBoTeq said:


> <P>With the new regulations dictating the minimum energy levels for cooling systems, heat pumps and furnaces depending on what region you are in, how is this going to change your business strategies?</P>


Depending on which you're speaking of....

Commercially speaking...most customers are not overly excited about paying the extra money for equipment unless they will see a reasonable amount of savings in relation to a specific amount of time (payback). So, in terms of regulations requiring a certain SEER or AFUE of equipment I would tend to believe that most HVAC providers will do their best to inform their customer base of what's available v/s what's practical and allow the customer to choose what is best for them. 

In short, I really do not see businesses changing anything as related to minimum requirements of SEER or AFUE, with exception of course to meeting those regulations.


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## RoBoTeq (Jun 18, 2009)

Where I am in PA, just north of the 90% minimum line, it is going to affect a lot of contractors who don't want to do the extra work to install a condensing furnace. These contractors are crying that condensing furnaces cannot be put into attics because they will freeze. They are crying that centrally located furnaces in finished basements will be difficult (they say impossible) to vent if there is a water heater using the chimney.

I somewhat suspected that the Southernmost states would not be affected much. 

For my area, I am glad that 80% furnaces will be going away. I truly don't think that 80% furnaces ever belonged in this area. 78%, I have no problem with. It is specifically 80% furnaces that are a real pain for an area where there are times when an unlined chimney will get cool enough to condense flue gases inside of the chimney.


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## acefurnacefixer (Jun 18, 2009)

Were can I find a list of the new standards? 
Thanks!


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## RoBoTeq (Jun 18, 2009)

acefurnacefixer said:


> Were can I find a list of the new standards?
> Thanks!


 What is in this article is what passed; http://www.achrnews.com/articles/118051-industry-awaits-regional-standards-ruling


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## acefurnacefixer (Jun 18, 2009)

thanks..........personally I am all for it............i get a hell of a lot more money for installing 90 then I do an 80, and honestly its only a couple hours of extra work for a well seasoned crew.


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## RoBoTeq (Jun 18, 2009)

acefurnacefixer said:


> thanks..........personally I am all for it............i get a hell of a lot more money for installing 90 then I do an 80, and honestly its only a couple hours of extra work for a well seasoned crew.


Especially for our areas of the country, I agree. I've been saying for years that 80% furnaces don't belong north of Georgia.


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## Fancy Shoes (Dec 9, 2012)

What is the reason you cant vent a 95% into a chimney? If you upgrade the water heater to a 95% can you run both into the chimney?


how do you run a 95% vent through a attic when there is a preexisting 4" metal exhaust from the old furnace running out through the roof, that just seems like a lot of work to change out a went in a roof with shingles and things? (where I work they just stick it through the vent in the roof so they dont have to mess with anything, but that seems crappy to me).


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## RoBoTeq (Jun 18, 2009)

Fancy Shoes said:


> What is the reason you cant vent a 95% into a chimney? If you upgrade the water heater to a 95% can you run both into the chimney?
> 
> 
> how do you run a 95% vent through a attic when there is a preexisting 4" metal exhaust from the old furnace running out through the roof, that just seems like a lot of work to change out a went in a roof with shingles and things? (where I work they just stick it through the vent in the roof so they dont have to mess with anything, but that seems crappy to me).


 Acidic condensation will destroy chimneys, so venting must be all the way to terminating outside to the ambient air.

Crappy or not, that's the best way to run a vent pipe.


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## Fancy Shoes (Dec 9, 2012)

RoBoTeq said:


> Acidic condensation will destroy chimneys, so venting must be all the way to terminating outside to the ambient air.
> 
> Crappy or not, that's the best way to run a vent pipe.


I cant believe I typed my question to make me sound illiterate. I really need to start proof reading. 

I meant to ask about why people dont redo the pipe going through the roof, so that you dont have a pvc sticking through metal pipe.


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## RoBoTeq (Jun 18, 2009)

Fancy Shoes said:


> I cant believe I typed my question to make me sound illiterate. I really need to start proof reading.
> 
> I meant to ask about why people dont redo the pipe going through the roof, so that you dont have a pvc sticking through metal pipe.


 Then again, are consumers going to pay the additional cost to make a vent termination look "pretty"?

There are many ways to skin a cat, but the real question is; "Does the cat really need to be skinned?"


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## jpb2 (Dec 27, 2009)

No big issue for us. 80 plus is a very small part of our sales


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## FloridaHVAC (Jan 26, 2011)

In South Florida the FPL (monopoly power company) rebates are so good that the 16 seer units sell for the same price as the 13 seer units. I dont think my company installed a single 13 seer system in 2012...


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